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Speed Limit Discussion


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Speed Limit  

1,109 members have voted

  1. 1. Should the speed limit be removed?



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1 hour ago, TheCreepyTruckr said:

If collisions are necessary why don't you people start making posts to implement collisions in the arcade server?  Instead we have constant posts of kids and crappy drivers wanting the speed limit removed on the SIMULATION server just because they want to be able to speed around other players.  Go turn the arcade server into the cesspit that was EU2 and leave the simulation server alone for those of us that actually enjoy it.

 

It's been suggested and rejected. Nobody forced you to read this post or comment in here. You came on your own and get mad because someone suggests something that you don't like. 

 

If they enable collisions in the arcade server, half of those who 'enjoy the simulation' will migrate to the arcade, and the simulation will struggle for players once again. That was the case back when EU2 was a thing and that would be the case now. And that's why i upvoted Nightblade's comment. Because i have much respect for those who played on the simulation server even when it didn't have 4k players but only 1-2k.

 

Back in the day, half of you in here played on EU2 even though EU1 was the simulation server. And you constantly complained about reckless driving and trolls. And when someone suggested that you migrate on the Sim Server, you would complain about the lack of players. 

 

Touch the ground a bit and get off your high horse.

 

 

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To drive at a speed that one feels safe at is not necessarily a safe speed. It is actually a prime example of overconfidence in ones driving skills which can have serious consequences.

One could argue that the speed limit should be lifted because every player is responsible for his actions and that in case of an incident he will be subject to punishment. But punishment does not prevent incidents from happening and especially not that another innocent players game experience is ruined.
Speed limit however does, because less and reasonable speed gives more time to react and with that gives the chance to avoid or reduce the number of incidents caused by excessive speed.
 

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1 hour ago, Joao Rodrigues said:

To drive at a speed that one feels safe at is not necessarily a safe speed. It is actually a prime example of overconfidence in ones driving skills which can have serious consequences.

One could argue that the speed limit should be lifted because every player is responsible for his actions and that in case of an incident he will be subject to punishment. But punishment does not prevent incidents from happening and especially not that another innocent players game experience is ruined.
Speed limit however does, because less and reasonable speed gives more time to react and with that gives the chance to avoid or reduce the number of incidents caused by excessive speed.
 

 

I agree. However, this unpredictability and these incidents is also the reason i'm playing this game. It is the reason Multiplayer is considered superior to Singleplayer.

I like the fact that whenever i enter the C-D road, i'm always vigilant for people overtaking or other incidents. I enjoy that.

If i want a better and safer environment, i would simply join ProMods Map (which is far superior than vanilla map) in Singleplayer and enjoy my time there.

 

Edit: And for that matter, there are many servers that one can find safe environments to drive. All i'm saying is that one of these servers should get the popular settings.

 

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22 hours ago, Random_Truck_Driver said:

It's been suggested and rejected. Nobody forced you to read this post or comment in here. You came on your own and get mad because someone suggests something that you don't like. 

And the TMP team and mods have stated that they're not going to remove the speed limit.  It's been suggested and rejected.  

I'm not mad at anyone, if anything I'm laughing at how crappy some of the arguments and logic are among the playerbase.

 

22 hours ago, Random_Truck_Driver said:

If they enable collisions in the arcade server, half of those who 'enjoy the simulation' will migrate to the arcade, and the simulation will struggle for players once again. That was the case back when EU2 was a thing and that would be the case now. And that's why i upvoted Nightblade's comment. Because i have much respect for those who played on the simulation server even when it didn't have 4k players but only 1-2k.

 

Back in the day, half of you in here played on EU2 even though EU1 was the simulation server. And you constantly complained about reckless driving and trolls. And when someone suggested that you migrate on the Sim Server, you would complain about the lack of players. 

None of you can provide a decent counter-argument apparently.  The best you seem to have is that if the arcade server had collisions, the sim server would be empty.  So? At least the sim players could enjoy the sim rather than have a bunch of entitled kids ruining it.  I loved the EU1 server back in the day and had plenty of enjoyable drives, the only time I touched EU2 was to play with friends and 9 times out of 10 I'd end up with multiple reports even if I wasn't near C-D.

 

But seriously, your argument is that we can't add collisions to the arcade server because it will make the sim server empty; so you'd rather remove any sim rules and allow the arcade kids to ruin the sim server?

 

22 hours ago, Random_Truck_Driver said:

Touch the ground a bit and get off your high horse.

Same could be said to you, mate.  You're currently arguing that the simulation inspired focus of the TMP team and their wishes shouldn't matter, because a bunch of you just want to speed or play recklessly. 

 

 

Honestly TMP team, please add collisions to the arcade server.  I want to watch their arguments turn to smoke as most players continue to use the sim server.

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I think that it's interesting that this topic has become quite heated in places, and it's clear that people feel quite passionately about the speed limit debate.

 

I think that the main split here stems from the fact that some people consider TMP to be an outright Trucking Simulator, and some others consider it to be a game and nothing more, which in turn splits opinion on what should and shouldn't be enforced.

 

I think it's important to remember that it is only an opinion that we're providing here, and ultimately the decision comes from the upper echelons of the community. If it was a democratic decision, we'd find ourselves making absolutely no progress and perpetually bickering about the same things, from speed, to scout cars, to save editing, and getting nothing else done.

 

We all have our opinions on the matter, but I don't think that should stop us enjoying what currently exists. The discussion we've had/are having is intriguing, but it shouldn't be at the expense of common courtesy. We all play here for a common purpose; to enjoy TMP.

Paddy

Prime Logistics | Former HR & Exam Team

TMP Former Events Team

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On 5/27/2020 at 8:54 PM, TheCreepyTruckr said:

And the TMP team and mods have stated that they're not going to remove the speed limit.  It's been suggested and rejected.  

I'm not mad at anyone, if anything I'm laughing at how crappy some of the arguments and logic are among the playerbase.

 

None of you can provide a decent counter-argument apparently.  The best you seem to have is that if the arcade server had collisions, the sim server would be empty.  So? At least the sim players could enjoy the sim rather than have a bunch of entitled kids ruining it.  I loved the EU1 server back in the day and had plenty of enjoyable drives, the only time I touched EU2 was to play with friends and 9 times out of 10 I'd end up with multiple reports even if I wasn't near C-D.

 

But seriously, your argument is that we can't add collisions to the arcade server because it will make the sim server empty; so you'd rather remove any sim rules and allow the arcade kids to ruin the sim server?

 

Same could be said to you, mate.  You're currently arguing that the simulation inspired focus of the TMP team and their wishes shouldn't matter, because a bunch of you just want to speed or play recklessly. 

 

Have you even read my arguments? Because your comments imply otherwise. 

 

My point all this time is that removing collisions from the arcade server greatly reduces immersion and thus making the Simulation Server, the best choice to play at. That's the foundation of my arguments. And as a natural follow up, that makes the Sim Server the popular one at the moment. The basic idea is for TMP to give one server (out of seven(?)) with collisions and no-speed limit. I'm not going to stuck at the name of the server.  And i wouldn't consider this as a post to change the settings of the simulation server, but rather as a post for TMP staff to consider the general sentiment regarding the speed limit.

 

I get that you want to drive to a simulation environment and you can achieve that by playing in almost any server but one. Why shouldn't the rest of the players who want to play in a different environment than you be prohibited?

I've also provided a solution for monitoring if it's such an issue for a server with no speed-limit. Just remove it! I'm sure most players won't mind. The reporting system is deeply flawed anyway.

 

You see there's no actual issue as to why there shouldn't be a server with these settings. So that raises a question. Why does TMP staff feel the need to enforce their 'Road to Simulation' vision? Why do they want to enforce their community to drive within simulation standards even though the general feeling leans on the other side? They made a public poll to get feedback for the /fix command but they couldn't make a poll for the speed limit?

 

 

Quote

Honestly TMP team, please add collisions to the arcade server.  I want to watch their arguments turn to smoke as most players continue to use the sim server.

 

I wouldn't bet on this ^^ . If anything this vote should have been a hint for you to what would happen if they add collisions in the arcade server.

 

Last but not least when you feel the need to insult one's comments, it gives an idea whether you're 'mad' or not, no matter what you say. So far almost everyone i've argued with, eventually felt the need to insult me because apparently i'm a reckless racer and a troll with crappy arguments but they failed to provide any decent arguments whatsoever.

 

So i'm asking again, Is it so hard to provide one server with these settings? By your words, nothing would change anyway.

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A server with those settings (no speed limits, collisions enabled and no reporting options) has been suggested and rejected. Feel free to insist, send a new suggestion or a feedback ticket with your thoughts. You may succeed where others failed. Or you may get the answers about why a no speed limits+collisions server won't happen. From authorized staff members, not from regular users. Keeping this discussion opened is pointless, no side is going to convince the other and no matter how many arguments we use against or in favor of, things won't change just because someone opened a poll and 800 people among thousands of players said that they want this or that. The way to change things is making reasoned suggestions, so the upper staff can assess what can be done and what can't. And let's not forget that it's not just what can be done, but also what the TMP staff want done. In the end, it's their mod, their servers, their rules. If they have decided to make TruckersMP with limitations, we, the users, can choose to accept those limitations and stay or not accept them and leave.

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This is not fun at all. When I'm in the high way I'm getting bored everytime now. Yeah we know there is a arcade server but there is no collision in that so not fun. Accident factor force me to focus in the game. So make a 2. server with no speed limit and collision. 

 

Leave us to decide

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16 hours ago, Tars61 said:

This is not fun at all. When I'm in the high way I'm getting bored everytime now. Yeah we know there is a arcade server but there is no collision in that so not fun. Accident factor force me to focus in the game. So make a 2. server with no speed limit and collision. 

 

Leave us to decide

So the idea is not bad, but it is a simulation and I think that one should stick to the roads. Because otherwise it would be called Renn euro Truck. but it's Euro Truck Simulation.

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19 hours ago, FernandoCR [ESP] said:

A server with those settings (no speed limits, collisions enabled and no reporting options) has been suggested and rejected. Feel free to insist, send a new suggestion or a feedback ticket with your thoughts. You may succeed where others failed. Or you may get the answers about why a no speed limits+collisions server won't happen. From authorized staff members, not from regular users. Keeping this discussion opened is pointless, no side is going to convince the other and no matter how many arguments we use against or in favor of, things won't change just because someone opened a poll and 800 people among thousands of players said that they want this or that. The way to change things is making reasoned suggestions, so the upper staff can assess what can be done and what can't. And let's not forget that it's not just what can be done, but also what the TMP staff want done. In the end, it's their mod, their servers, their rules. If they have decided to make TruckersMP with limitations, we, the users, can choose to accept those limitations and stay or not accept them and leave.

 

This is so wrong in so many levels.

 

First of all, this discussion/poll has succeeded in conveying the general feeling for the speed limit to TMP staff, when every suggestion failed and only made it seem that there are only some individuals that desire a no-speed limit server. This is far from a pointless discussion.

 

Secondly, anyone who claims that this poll is not an actual representation of the community's opinion, clearly doesn't understand how statistics work. And I'm not gonna bother explaining. You can go ahead and deny how that poll is impartial in a forum where most active members are for the speed limit. You can also go ahead and deny that the playerbase is not shrinking in a mod that claims to have almost 3.5 million users but averages 2k users in their main server.

 

In the end of the day, this thread/poll shows all the flaws in their 'Road to Simulation' vision.

 

You've got one thing right though. The TMP staff will do as they please. And that's the most important reason of this thread's existence, considering how the (new) upper staff got an ever growing mod and made the main server struggling for players. If they ever wonder why they failed, this thread will be the answer. 

 

I only wish that they'll learn from their failure and change their decision. And if they don't, I'm already with one foot out the door. My playtime in their servers is greatly reduced, and once IFMP goes live, they'll lose me forever as a player. And i can only assume how many players who share my logic will follow. 

 

EDIT: And i still wonder why it's such an unreasoning suggestion to give one server out of 7 with these settings.

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12 hours ago, Random_Truck_Driver said:

First of all, this discussion/poll has succeeded in conveying the general feeling for the speed limit to TMP staff, when every suggestion failed and only made it seem that there are only some individuals that desire a no-speed limit server. This is far from a pointless discussion.

Just let me tell you something. You probably know by now that I'm in favor of the speed limits. I've always been. I hated what MP had become and yes, EU#2 was the server of choice if you wanted to see other players around, simply because it had twice as many slots as EU#1, but it was almost unplayable for anyone doing WoT jobs, since it was almost impossible to finish one without lots of damage caused by the speeding drivers. So I sent a suggestion. In my suggestion, I proposed to change the servers into one Simulation server with 90 Km/h speed limits and 5000 slots and another one without speed limits, no collisions and 5000 slots. I reasoned that the size of the server wouldn't be an issue like before, when people would mostly use the server with a higher capacity, also that setting a 90 Km/h limit in Simulation and removing the 150 Km/h speed limit in the other one should make speeders happy to move into the latter. And by removing collisions, the number of "accidents"/reports would go down by a lot.

 

Some time later, Road to Simulation happened. Not exactly as I had suggested, because the Simulation had 110 Km/h instead of 90 Km/h and the Arcade couldn't be made with 5000 slots (hardware limitations at the moment). No polls, no votes, no endless discussions. A suggestion, where I spoke my mind about how the MP could improve. Since then, lots of topics, polls, suggestions have been made to remove/raise the speed limits in Simulation servers or enable collisions in Arcade servers. Not a single one has succeeded. This was the point of my previous comment. And this is why I believe that this topic, just as all other ones before and the ones to come, are pointless.

 

Maybe it's just that the TMP staff are happy with what they currently have. Maybe the reasons given to change things are not reasonable enough for them. Maybe they don't care if the speeding fans leave. I'm not the one to tell, only Staff can say why they don't want to change the current servers and the way to know is asking them. A feedback ticket addressed to the Project Managers can get you the answer.

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Speed limit is kind of an essential when it comes to sim driving games, without it you'll have players speeding around and possibly bumping into players who take the game seriously! Although I feel that certain places in Paris should have the "city speed limit" called off, especially along the highways.

       

 

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On 5/31/2020 at 2:52 AM, FernandoCR [ESP] said:

Just let me tell you something. You probably know by now that I'm in favor of the speed limits. I've always been. I hated what MP had become and yes, EU#2 was the server of choice if you wanted to see other players around, simply because it had twice as many slots as EU#1, but it was almost unplayable for anyone doing WoT jobs, since it was almost impossible to finish one without lots of damage caused by the speeding drivers. So I sent a suggestion. In my suggestion, I proposed to change the servers into one Simulation server with 90 Km/h speed limits and 5000 slots and another one without speed limits, no collisions and 5000 slots. I reasoned that the size of the server wouldn't be an issue like before, when people would mostly use the server with a higher capacity, also that setting a 90 Km/h limit in Simulation and removing the 150 Km/h speed limit in the other one should make speeders happy to move into the latter. And by removing collisions, the number of "accidents"/reports would go down by a lot.

 

Some time later, Road to Simulation happened. Not exactly as I had suggested, because the Simulation had 110 Km/h instead of 90 Km/h and the Arcade couldn't be made with 5000 slots (hardware limitations at the moment). No polls, no votes, no endless discussions. A suggestion, where I spoke my mind about how the MP could improve. Since then, lots of topics, polls, suggestions have been made to remove/raise the speed limits in Simulation servers or enable collisions in Arcade servers. Not a single one has succeeded. This was the point of my previous comment. And this is why I believe that this topic, just as all other ones before and the ones to come, are pointless.

 

Maybe it's just that the TMP staff are happy with what they currently have. Maybe the reasons given to change things are not reasonable enough for them. Maybe they don't care if the speeding fans leave. I'm not the one to tell, only Staff can say why they don't want to change the current servers and the way to know is asking them. A feedback ticket addressed to the Project Managers can get you the answer.

 

Well, your suggestion basically reflects my entire point. It's a reasonable suggestion and it addresses the problems of reckless driving for those who enjoy a simulation environment and those who enjoy playing 'recklessly'. It's a middle-ground solution that would've worked great.

 

The problem though is that your suggestion was never implemented. The 'Road to Simulation' didn't come as a middle-ground solution, but instead it forced people to either adapt to a new environment or leave. It only showed that the (new) staff didn't understand their own game and its community. They felt the need to enforce to players how the game should be played. Their vision also made it clear that anyone who didn't agree with it, is free to leave and if they wouldn't comply, they'd probably end up banned for a long period of time. 

 

The only people that this 'vision' left 'unharmed' were those who enjoyed driving below 110 km/h like yourself. But looking further into the issue, this has cause two problems. I've mentioned both problems in previous posts, yet you argued that they don't exist. 

 

The first problem is that players are leaving the game faster than new players arrive to cover their 'spot'. Like i said, those who didn't want to adapt to the new rules reduced their playtime (like myself) or even left the game and those who didn't want to adapt to the new rules but kept playing were probably banned somewhere along the way.

 

The second problem is the feeling of resentment that the 'Road to Simulation' vision created to the players. The management has made it clear with their actions that they're unwilling to listen to the community. That was made specifically clear to me once i joined the IFMP community and read plenty of comments from disappointed TMP players.

 

So the minute that a new MP community appears, people won't think twice before leaving this one. TMP has offered so many things the past year and yet this hardly reflects in player numbers. Are you naive to believe that the player numbers won't change if another MP mod reach the surface? And before questioning the existence of a new mod, i'd urge you to remember the comments people made about TMP before the initial launch. Even SCS said back then that it's impossible to create an MP mod for ETS2.

 

And i'm not arguing that this is a problem that will appear immediately. Maybe in 6 months, a year or even more but the foundation is there. At some point this whole thing will backfire.

 

But in a scenario that this would happen today, how many players would leave TMP and what would happen to the mod?

 

Personally, i believe that this is a great question to answer because people are good at solving short-term problems but terrible at planning for the longterm. And if i had to answer this question, i'd probably say that the playerbase of TMP would drop by 50% the first month. And in that scenario, you even said it yourself, you'd rather play in a server with the most players available.

 

So where would that leave you? In the same suggestion you did one year ago. To find a middle ground solution for both parties, but at that point it would be too late.

 

 

 

EDIT: Also i forgot to mention, I've made my suggestions a couple of months ago and was aggresively rejected. Like i said then, the game has deeper flaws yet the staff members only seem interested in enforcing their 'culture'. So now i'm more interested in sharing my thoughts with the community and leave my feedback in case somebody ever wonders what went wrong with the mod.

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

The speed limit is important and shouldn't be removed because it helps keep everyone safer and reduce vehicle collisions.

 

At higher speeds, drivers will have less time to react, increasing the chance of a collision.

Vehicles are also more unstable (particularly the Skoda), which also increases the chance of a collision.

 

The speed limit also makes it more realistic - trucks would certainly not be going above 90km/h in real life Europe, which is why ETS2 limits you to that by default.

Kind regards, 

.Quality

GLL3Hp3.png + rk0ThyI.png

 

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Arcade Server for ATS is great. Is better then nothing and way much better then "sim" wich is not is. never was in both games. I wish there are also a server without collision on and  with a speed limit (around 160-180 KM H is more the enough. We started / buyed the games at that amount of speed for many years ago. so we want it back now ) If there are trolls etc the should be banned for ever. please upgrade REPORTING system. i will report ALL of it if they don't drive nice. Sometimes very easily when i stream on twitch etc. And the Speed limit should not work on HIGHWAYS NO MATTER WHAT. Thats the same like a bot / like tesla trucks are buildit in in ATS .  I want to decide when i want to break  EVEN THE SPEED LIMIT ON THE HIGHWAYS that has NOTHING TO DO WITH A SIM etc. Or is this TeslaTrucks ? I not a Bot/ Robot etc.  Me as European i don't care about that unstable ETS2 trucks. if i fart thos ets2 trucks keeps flips over  amd over by like 10kmh every corner etc!!! At that speed nothing happend in ATS.  The sould DELETE and Stop working on ETS2. ATS is the future also in EU! is my opinion. nobody can took it away. :P AND check the vote about it . like 1 year at over 70% over 800ppl say YES ! . how many year shold we pass? ATS need to be Finished soon as possible. There are still to many to want it to play in his own state ONLINE and the other problem is why NOBODY around is we are still need to downgrade the game OVER 1 month! nobody like that even there are a new TRUCK out there like the MACK  or alot things got fixed. THATS WHY are somany server nearly empthy . thats sooooo easly to understand but  thos 3-5years old kids never understood this. howlong we need to wait to can play the US CA AUS... ONLINE?  when i 90+++ years old and about to die ? soooolong we  need to wait?  we all never get younger anymore. there are alot  real truckers what i know around the globe. they are in 50 or 60s so they dont have that much time left to play the game IF SCS and TMP keeps thos upgrades once a year or once in 2 years it feels like it. so guys think about it an replay :)    and ones again i just want to have the option when i want to drive fast like so fast the truck gos like 180kmh or took like an external  or just a normal marked and to my own speed limit like the hole job 110kmh  more or  less. I wana decide when i want to go fast or slow like a turttle even on a highway. is this now more clear / understandable for everybody inhere? 

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First the ones who drive more that 90 km/h should learn to drive, even now everyone trying to go faster then you even when you drive 109km/h so before we remove the speed limit first learn to drive and not useless overtake... I would put everywhere 90 and you would see there would always be a players, cuz it's only about population not about speed limit.

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