Jump to content
Scania LTD l Top Bloke

Addition of AI Traffic

Recommended Posts

Good day guys,

 

So this is a forum which basically outlines my thoughts on the idea of AI traffic being added some pros and cons (in my opinion) - just to help the team with suggestions and give the community some food for thought.

 

So we all enjoy the idea of driving with vehicles around us, we find it boring driving long high ways alone when there are 200 people riding CD Road...Now whilst the idea of AI traffic in MP does seem rather exciting id like to state some cons that need to be considered. 

 

~ Will AI be "No Collision" and be drive through able?

~ Will AI be seen by just the one person or will the same traffic be visible to everyone?

~ Will they stop traffic dead when a truck is trying to merge on (like they do in SP) - this could lead to serious crashes, especially at speed. 

 

Some things like that do need to be considered however the pros of AI being added (in my opinion) could include;

 

~ Active thought having to take place on the road (having to think about junctions ahead) 

~ Give a presence or aspect of "realism" when driving

~ Allow for proper traffic techniques such as roll-merging (this is when you get up to speed before merging onto a motorway or fast road, a lot of people don't do this!)

 

In order for AI to be added I feel it is crucial that AI works based on the amount of players around. For example; 

In Calais - there should be very minimal to NO traffic based on 20-70 players present in the area. 

In Rome - there should be moderate traffic based around 2-5 players present in the area. 

High populated areas will need to be prone to AI to minimise the amount that could go wrong, and even if AI are drive through able they become a distraction and something else to look at so they should just be scrapped from High Pop areas. 

Along with this I do feel they should be Drive through able, as unrealistic as it is if something bad does happen, like you need to desperately get over, then at least it wont have a major impact and cause you to stop.

 

Thank you very much for taking the time to read this forum! 

I do apologise I do like to make things rather wordy but detail is key.

 

Ill be open to explain further thoughts and accept any thoughts, opinions or feedback regarding the topic

Have a good one guys! 

 

Top Bloke

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I thought you would say something about technical aspects of it... I think the main problem is the technical realization of this feature, because

1. A server would have to synchronize every AI vehicle's coordinates for every client which has this traffic in its visible area = increased network loads

2. When we see a big group of players, our FPS goes down (even on a powerful PC). But what would be a fundamental difference between AI vehicles and players' vehicles for a client? I think, the game optimization is too weak for that.

3. Also who's gonna process the AI logic? I don't think, clients could be involved in the processing, so the server would have to analyze the full road situation for every AI vehicle. Could a server do that for 1000+ players, considering the other work it ought to do?

 

I'm not a specialist at this. It's just my incompetent opinion. But i'd like to know what specialists think about these aspects.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

AI would be an amazing addition to TruckersMP, however as you have stated, there are a lot of cons to be thought about when trying to implement it, with the major one in my opinion being will everyone be able to see the exact same AI.

Just imagine the C-D road, it is massively congested as it is, along with trolls as well, will this affect the congestion and make it worse than it already is, also think further afield, more traffic will cause more congestion which leads to more accidents/crashes which ultimately leads to more reports been submitted, this will cause strain on not only the Game Moderators who are already massively busy, but the community itself will be affected as people will get more and more annoyed with multiple things such as congestion and reports not been claimed either at all or not quick enough, this will result in yet more conflict on the forums which will make the workload even worse for community moder... Basically all I am saying is that adding AI could lead to a never ending backlog of problems after problems.

 

I am not denying the pros, I personally think AI would be an amazing addition, however I just think the developers need to really think about it before it gets implemented, if it ever does get implemented.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, Scania LTD l Top Bloke said:

~ Allow for proper traffic techniques such as roll-merging (this is when you get up to speed before merging onto a motorway or fast road, a lot of people don't do this!)

Merging lanes are almost always too short, or completely absent, even in the latest map expansions.

 

13 hours ago, Scania LTD l Top Bloke said:

Along with this I do feel they should be Drive through able, as unrealistic as it is if something bad does happen, like you need to desperately get over, then at least it wont have a major impact and cause you to stop.

I think that is really bad idea, imagine this situtation:

You are merging onto the motorway and there is big AI vehicle, a bus or a truck, behind you at the safe distance in the lane you want to merge in, going about the same speed as you, so you merge in front of that vehicle, because you can't see what's going on behind it. And then, someone blasts through that vehicle from behind at top speed and hit you, because they also can't see clearly, what's going on in front of it. Similar situation could happen at any junction.

 

I really like the idea of AI traffic in multiplayer, but I suspect that technical problems behind it are too great to overcome, in combination with all the possible problems that would arise from the interactions between players and AI vehicles, this feature is extremely unlikely to be added.

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 9/4/2019 at 6:53 PM, Myau91 said:

I thought you would say something about technical aspects of it... I think the main problem is the technical realization of this feature, because

1. A server would have to synchronize every AI vehicle's coordinates for every client which has this traffic in its visible area = increased network loads

2. When we see a big group of players, our FPS goes down (even on a powerful PC). But what would be a fundamental difference between AI vehicles and players' vehicles for a client? I think, the game optimization is too weak for that.

3. Also who's gonna process the AI logic? I don't think, clients could be involved in the processing, so the server would have to analyze the full road situation for every AI vehicle. Could a server do that for 1000+ players, considering the other work it ought to do?

 

I'm not a specialist at this. It's just my incompetent opinion. But i'd like to know what specialists think about these aspects.

Haha yeh nah bro xD I wish my brain could go that in-depth, but i read through what you wrote and like i agree with all of it how the game will optimise and run with AI along with players will be drastic for everyone depending on the PC they have.

I wish i was more of a software like person to actually go in-depth with those sorts of things but its along the right lines like how servers will run. 

We have a lot of very good, detailed work and opinion on AI in this forum alone like we have physical aspects of AI being added, Feedback on the idea of it and the software side of it so i appreciate the contribution :)

On 9/4/2019 at 10:21 PM, Callum Johnson said:

AI would be an amazing addition to TruckersMP, however as you have stated, there are a lot of cons to be thought about when trying to implement it, with the major one in my opinion being will everyone be able to see the exact same AI.

Just imagine the C-D road, it is massively congested as it is, along with trolls as well, will this affect the congestion and make it worse than it already is, also think further afield, more traffic will cause more congestion which leads to more accidents/crashes which ultimately leads to more reports been submitted, this will cause strain on not only the Game Moderators who are already massively busy, but the community itself will be affected as people will get more and more annoyed with multiple things such as congestion and reports not been claimed either at all or not quick enough, this will result in yet more conflict on the forums which will make the workload even worse for community moder... Basically all I am saying is that adding AI could lead to a never ending backlog of problems after problems.

 

I am not denying the pros, I personally think AI would be an amazing addition, however I just think the developers need to really think about it before it gets implemented, if it ever does get implemented.

Im not sure if congestion would be a massive factor as we all enjoy a bit of traffic, it keeps us on our toes and alert. When congestion becomes too much is when its combined with pre-existing congestion. So like you said CD road, calais and duisberg for example those areas would need to be completely prone and removed of all AI just to allocate the all ready existing player traffic there. I feel they should add more roads branching off of CD and even incorporate multiple side routes that run parallel or near by just to try and balance traffic, whilst also making major cities much larger (like Paris for example being spread out) but that is another forum xD so i will stick to topic.

Game staff would be under a lot more stress when it comes to reports and would need to incorporate AI and if they played a part in the accident which is why i feel No-Clip AI would be good so we could drive right through them if need be. 

Thank you for your input :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 9/5/2019 at 12:30 AM, Granite said:

Merging lanes are almost always too short, or completely absent, even in the latest map expansions.

 

I think that is really bad idea, imagine this situtation:

You are merging onto the motorway and there is big AI vehicle, a bus or a truck, behind you at the safe distance in the lane you want to merge in, going about the same speed as you, so you merge in front of that vehicle, because you can't see what's going on behind it. And then, someone blasts through that vehicle from behind at top speed and hit you, because they also can't see clearly, what's going on in front of it. Similar situation could happen at any junction.

 

I really like the idea of AI traffic in multiplayer, but I suspect that technical problems behind it are too great to overcome, in combination with all the possible problems that would arise from the interactions between players and AI vehicles, this feature is extremely unlikely to be added.

 

Well as dangerous as roll merging is already there is no safer way to enter a high speed road then to get up with speed, drivers in the inside lane should be cautious (specially since you should have your hazards on, then indicate a few seconds before merging in to let drivers aware you are coming back onto the road) but i can see what you mean by a heavy vehicle coming up and honestly the only way to avoid that is for the person merging on to be more aware of their surroundings and plan ahead, how much shoulder they have, how fast before they merge on, find a gap in traffic and take it etc. That is the only viable way i can avoiding that issue 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The main reason this is not happening at the moment is that it would need a super computer server to run it. Cause every single AI car would have to be synchronized so that means if there is 4000 people on and each person has lets say 5 AI cars or trucks around them that would be 20000 AI cars and trucks that the server would have to calculate all the time. In SP, the area you drive in is the only area that is loaded in game. And the x amount of AI traffic around you is only around where you are. So your computer only has to render in the area you are in with AI traffic in the area you are in. I think the MP server loads everything all the time (correct me if i am wrong). And it would have to load and calculate the movement of 20000 AI cars and trucks all the time.  

 

Not only that but trolls could get a whole lot of fun out of the AI traffic. Cause lets say a troll decides to block the road. Not only do you have normal players that gets blocked but also AI traffic. This could cause HUGE line ups of AI traffic and players and it could be a huge mess. Not only that but if they behave like normal AI traffic does in SP that means every AI truck or car will stop instantly as soon as you are close to them. Like if you swerve close to an AI traffic they just stop. That could also cause major problems for people around you.  Since someone could just swerve close to an AI car and make it stop so someone would ram into that car or truck. AI traffic is just a bad idea in general unless you have small servers with like 10-20 people max that then drive around with AI traffic on private like servers. Other than that its just a huge problem.

  • True Story 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 9/9/2019 at 10:15 AM, MrSirViking said:

The main reason this is not happening at the moment is that it would need a super computer server to run it. Cause every single AI car would have to be synchronized so that means if there is 4000 people on and each person has lets say 5 AI cars or trucks around them that would be 20000 AI cars and trucks that the server would have to calculate all the time. In SP, the area you drive in is the only area that is loaded in game. And the x amount of AI traffic around you is only around where you are. So your computer only has to render in the area you are in with AI traffic in the area you are in. I think the MP server loads everything all the time (correct me if i am wrong). And it would have to load and calculate the movement of 20000 AI cars and trucks all the time.  

 

Not only that but trolls could get a whole lot of fun out of the AI traffic. Cause lets say a troll decides to block the road. Not only do you have normal players that gets blocked but also AI traffic. This could cause HUGE line ups of AI traffic and players and it could be a huge mess. Not only that but if they behave like normal AI traffic does in SP that means every AI truck or car will stop instantly as soon as you are close to them. Like if you swerve close to an AI traffic they just stop. That could also cause major problems for people around you.  Since someone could just swerve close to an AI car and make it stop so someone would ram into that car or truck. AI traffic is just a bad idea in general unless you have small servers with like 10-20 people max that then drive around with AI traffic on private like servers. Other than that its just a huge problem.

Bruh massive facts!!

That is something to really consider, would you say it would be more of a smaller server type of thing then? Like a server that was like "AI Sim" then have a max pop of like 500 

My god imagine CD road with like 200 trucks plus like 1000 AI cars at that train railway xD would be kinda funny lets be real

VERY VERY good and valid points said however, well said

Thank you for the input :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Guys, half the server cant drive without crashing on nearly empty roads. Adding in AI would be complete chaos.....

 

look what happens on special WOT events as to how the server handles mass traffic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Scania LTD l Top Bloke said:

Bruh massive facts!!

That is something to really consider, would you say it would be more of a smaller server type of thing then? Like a server that was like "AI Sim" then have a max pop of like 500 

My god imagine CD road with like 200 trucks plus like 1000 AI cars at that train railway xD would be kinda funny lets be real

VERY VERY good and valid points said however, well said

Thank you for the input :)

Thank you :)

Now i would hope that if something like this ever comes, that there would be a sort of thing in place where if there is a certain amount of trucks around no AI will spawn. Cause as you say CD road would just be one long grid lock if you have 200 trucks and then 1000 AI traffic on that road too. So in that case no AI traffic would spawn. But that would still mean that there would be a huge amount of AI traffic the server had to calculate somewhere else.  But yeah maybe with 500 people on it could work. That would only be 2500 AI Traffic. But i still think that is a lot. Cause the server might have 4000 people on. But they are all mostly normal humans driving their own truck. So the server dosent have to calculate the movement of those trucks and cars. Cause i am the one driving my own truck or car. Where as with the AI traffic the server would be driving all those i think. I might be wrong on all this, but that was my thought.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...