Why players are not joining sim 2 even though tmp has made it EU 2

[Zodiac]

Most players are in favour of choosing the server that is crowded, there are many players coming and going from the opposite and next to you while driving. On the empty server, there is less player density and people do not prefer it.

['Rossoo770s.]

I voted NO to the 150kmh limit at the poll...so I never go there on SIM2 but I prefer SIM and respect the limits,so I play always on SIM1. Also because there are a lot more people and there is more fun even respecting the limits....simulation 2 is for those who took this game as NFS or Formula 1 i.e. 5% of 5 million players... This game IS A SIMULATOR not a NFS Game! The limits on SIM1 should be set at 90kmh max like IRL.

[Random_Truck_Driver]

On 4/27/2023 at 9:26 PM, McLaren2555 said:

im really wondering why the hell players are not joining sim 2 even though tmp has approved our wish for comeback of EU 2 server.The community used to bark like dogs to introduce no speed limit or to bring back Eu 2 ever since road to simulation was introduced like for around more than 3 years.Now that the players have got their wish why dont they just make it like EU 2 of pre 2019.Its really strange that maximum players voted for no speed limit or EU 2 server in the surveys.BUT now its the complete opposite.

Many players i talked to in sim 1 and everysingle of them said sim 2 is empty and when it gets populated they will join happily.Really love to know your opinions on this.EU 2 server is what made tmp it is now,it gave tmp recognition of a fun to play game,back then due to EU 2 the craze was creazy and it was also seen in youtube @Foobrother @Random_Truck_Driver @Jeronimο

 

My view is that the community in TMP is much more simulation-oriented than what it used to be back in 2018. I chatted with a bunch of people on Sim 1 and it seems that they considered Sim 2 as a troll server. When the exact same thing happened back in 2016 with servers being renamed to EU1 (The simulation) & EU2 (The casual), all people jumped on EU2. It wasn't by accident, people back then preferred a more casual playstyle.

 

But today, after 3 years of Road to Simulation & the release of Convoy Mode how many casual players are left and why would a casual player come to TMP in the first place? RTS made sure to gate-keep the game for a more simulation-oriented crowd. With the release of Convoy Mode, all those who didn't like the RTS settings left. And why would they stay? TMP had restricted the server settings to suit only a specific type of player & had very harsh rules.

 

Looking back for me, TMP peaked in 2018 when i had the most fun inside the servers. Like i've aforementioned, chaos in the C-D road gave the game a unique flavor. Something that Convoy will never achieve, but at the same time TMP no longer offers. Sure it could become frustrating at times, but it was something to come back for.

 

Nowadays, what does TMP offers that Convoy doesn't? More players. But convoy has already started offering Dedicated Game Servers and it's a matter of time before they optimize the game to support more players. I expect that at least 32 player slots will be available in the near future. Add to the fact that Convoy offers AI traffic and it's a much superior game.

[--Zyga--]

I think people are used to SIM 1 because there are a lot of people and when you play it's a pleasure to meet someone else, instead SIM 2 there are few people and difficult to meet but for convoy it's perfect, little chaos and little trolls.
I prefer where there are people

[McLaren2555]

On 5/4/2023 at 10:18 PM, Random_Truck_Driver said:

 

My view is that the community in TMP is much more simulation-oriented than what it used to be back in 2018. I chatted with a bunch of people on Sim 1 and it seems that they considered Sim 2 as a troll server. When the exact same thing happened back in 2016 with servers being renamed to EU1 (The simulation) & EU2 (The casual), all people jumped on EU2. It wasn't by accident, people back then preferred a more casual playstyle.

 

But today, after 3 years of Road to Simulation & the release of Convoy Mode how many casual players are left and why would a casual player come to TMP in the first place? RTS made sure to gate-keep the game for a more simulation-oriented crowd. With the release of Convoy Mode, all those who didn't like the RTS settings left. And why would they stay? TMP had restricted the server settings to suit only a specific type of player & had very harsh rules.

 

Looking back for me, TMP peaked in 2018 when i had the most fun inside the servers. Like i've aforementioned, chaos in the C-D road gave the game a unique flavor. Something that Convoy will never achieve, but at the same time TMP no longer offers. Sure it could become frustrating at times, but it was something to come back for.

 

Nowadays, what does TMP offers that Convoy doesn't? More players. But convoy has already started offering Dedicated Game Servers and it's a matter of time before they optimize the game to support more players. I expect that at least 32 player slots will be available in the near future. Add to the fact that Convoy offers AI traffic and it's a much superior game.

Absolutely very sharp on the spot in depth analysis, i can also relate to you i too had the most fun before tmp kicked in with road to sim.Wish SCS comes up with their own MMO  that would be too much fun.Actually the chaos of C-D road back then gave fame to tmp.I would like to share an instance, i bet you will spit your drink laughing , it happened i guess back in 2021 or 2020 , i was banned due to dangerous attempt of overtaking.It was like , I was coming in my scania r  series from duisburg and was crossing the fuel station ( the first one when going from calais to duisburg) and i tried to pull off a sudden overtake and a skoda was coming from opposite side as well and he and i both braked hard but couldnt stop in time so he had to go offroad,i was banned.When i appealed saying that i didnt hit him and it was just unintentional he replied that " imagine if you are on road in real life in your car and a truck tries to do that with you,wont you be scared and put the lives of passengers in danger '' this reply literally had me laughing for 2 days straight.He was comparing the game with real life . When i said its a game he said no we follow real life. Such was the fever of Road To Sim in admins and other tmp staffs

[Dawn - Da Peng]

It depends on which server you want to enter.Some people are already familiar with and rely on S1.

[Random_Truck_Driver]

On 5/6/2023 at 9:38 AM, McLaren2555 said:

Absolutely very sharp on the spot in depth analysis, i can also relate to you i too had the most fun before tmp kicked in with road to sim.Wish SCS comes up with their own MMO  that would be too much fun.Actually the chaos of C-D road back then gave fame to tmp.I would like to share an instance, i bet you will spit your drink laughing , it happened i guess back in 2021 or 2020 , i was banned due to dangerous attempt of overtaking.It was like , I was coming in my scania r  series from duisburg and was crossing the fuel station ( the first one when going from calais to duisburg) and i tried to pull off a sudden overtake and a skoda was coming from opposite side as well and he and i both braked hard but couldnt stop in time so he had to go offroad,i was banned.When i appealed saying that i didnt hit him and it was just unintentional he replied that " imagine if you are on road in real life in your car and a truck tries to do that with you,wont you be scared and put the lives of passengers in danger '' this reply literally had me laughing for 2 days straight.He was comparing the game with real life . When i said its a game he said no we follow real life. Such was the fever of Road To Sim in admins and other tmp staffs

 

Yeah, harsh punishments for minor reasons -especially when other drivers were not harmed- were the worst aspect of RTS. Some decisions were truly horrible when it comes to running an MMO community. It's certainly one of the reasons why TMP was dethroned so easy from Convoy. And i don't really expect things to ever go back to what it was.

[McLaren2555]

On 5/9/2023 at 4:17 AM, Random_Truck_Driver said:

 

Yeah, harsh punishments for minor reasons -especially when other drivers were not harmed- were the worst aspect of RTS. Some decisions were truly horrible when it comes to running an MMO community. It's certainly one of the reasons why TMP was dethroned so easy from Convoy. And i don't really expect things to ever go back to what it was.

the harsh punishments are still  present even with their change in vision it just got toned done very little very very little.BTW did you try the new MAN?

[MrSirViking]

On 5/6/2023 at 8:38 AM, McLaren2555 said:

Absolutely very sharp on the spot in depth analysis, i can also relate to you i too had the most fun before tmp kicked in with road to sim.Wish SCS comes up with their own MMO  that would be too much fun.Actually the chaos of C-D road back then gave fame to tmp.I would like to share an instance, i bet you will spit your drink laughing , it happened i guess back in 2021 or 2020 , i was banned due to dangerous attempt of overtaking.It was like , I was coming in my scania r  series from duisburg and was crossing the fuel station ( the first one when going from calais to duisburg) and i tried to pull off a sudden overtake and a skoda was coming from opposite side as well and he and i both braked hard but couldnt stop in time so he had to go offroad,i was banned.When i appealed saying that i didnt hit him and it was just unintentional he replied that " imagine if you are on road in real life in your car and a truck tries to do that with you,wont you be scared and put the lives of passengers in danger '' this reply literally had me laughing for 2 days straight.He was comparing the game with real life . When i said its a game he said no we follow real life. Such was the fever of Road To Sim in admins and other tmp staffs

Its a game you say? What sort of game? First person shooter? no. Racing game? no. Fifa game? No. Ohhh Wait! There it was! Trucking Simulation Game. Simulation game! And what does a simulation game strive to do? Simulate the real thing. And so that is what we do or try to at least. Now you claim you that things where more relaxed before road to simulation. But that is not actually the case. The thing you got banned for would also have gotten you banned before road to simulation. Maybe not quite as long but it would still have gotten you banned, with the same reason. You endangered someone else by not making sure that there was no traffic before you went overtaking. The main reason why Road to simulation was introduced was to try and make this a better simulation experience and to try and calm the CD road a bit. Everyone could see it, 150km/h on the CD road caused chaos and the short ban times never did anything to stop people from braking the rules. And so we simply had to do something and so Road to simulation was introduced. Did it work? Yes to some degree, but we have also realized that some of it might have been too harsh and so toned some stuff down again, like ban lengths and such.

[LUPO (ITA)]

Hello. First of all thank you for taking the time to ask this question. 

 

I think that probably on the EU sim 2 server there are few people and being that in the truckersmp there is no traffic, people prefer to at least play where there is more player traffic. 

[Random_Truck_Driver]

On 5/17/2023 at 12:04 PM, MrSirViking said:

Its a game you say? What sort of game? First person shooter? no. Racing game? no. Fifa game? No. Ohhh Wait! There it was! Trucking Simulation Game. Simulation game! And what does a simulation game strive to do? Simulate the real thing. And so that is what we do or try to at least. Now you claim you that things where more relaxed before road to simulation. But that is not actually the case. The thing you got banned for would also have gotten you banned before road to simulation. Maybe not quite as long but it would still have gotten you banned, with the same reason. You endangered someone else by not making sure that there was no traffic before you went overtaking. The main reason why Road to simulation was introduced was to try and make this a better simulation experience and to try and calm the CD road a bit. Everyone could see it, 150km/h on the CD road caused chaos and the short ban times never did anything to stop people from braking the rules. And so we simply had to do something and so Road to simulation was introduced. Did it work? Yes to some degree, but we have also realized that some of it might have been too harsh and so toned some stuff down again, like ban lengths and such.

 

What do you mean tone it down? The new rules didn't even exist in the past and it seems that there is finally some common sense applied as well. The RTS tried to enforce a driving culture in the game that only a small % in the game wished to follow. And sure it made the C-D road less chaotic but it also arguably made the game less fun and drove a lot of players away

[MrSirViking]

1 hour ago, Random_Truck_Driver said:

 

What do you mean tone it down? The new rules didn't even exist in the past and it seems that there is finally some common sense applied as well. The RTS tried to enforce a driving culture in the game that only a small % in the game wished to follow. And sure it made the C-D road less chaotic but it also arguably made the game less fun and drove a lot of players away

Well we have relaxed a bit on the ban lengths and you no longer get permanently banned if you have 6 bans within a year and even ban evading is not a permanent ban any more. And so The ban lengths are more relaxed now than they where under RTS.
Drove a lot of people away? A year after Road To Simulation was introduced we had the highest number of players playing at the same time that we have ever had. Almost two years after it was introduced we had the second highest number playing at the same time that we have ever had, It was not until convoy was introduced that we lost a bunch of players. Which makes sense. Convoy offers are more relaxed environment where you wont get rammed by random players from the CD road and it has AI traffic and it also offers you to use any mod you want. We cant do that atm. And so it does make sense that we lost some players to that. But to say that RTS drove a lot of players away is simply not really true. Usually the people who where mad with RTS, where the people who had a hard time following the rules. These days we have about the numbers we had before RTS. But we have never had as many people playing as we did during RTS.

[Miyu*]

 

At the end, what players "really" wanted is to drive together.

So it's habit because it's been years? Or just conformity? It'll be an interesting topic.

[Random_Truck_Driver]

10 hours ago, MrSirViking said:

Well we have relaxed a bit on the ban lengths and you no longer get permanently banned if you have 6 bans within a year and even ban evading is not a permanent ban any more. And so The ban lengths are more relaxed now than they where under RTS.
Drove a lot of people away? A year after Road To Simulation was introduced we had the highest number of players playing at the same time that we have ever had. Almost two years after it was introduced we had the second highest number playing at the same time that we have ever had, It was not until convoy was introduced that we lost a bunch of players. Which makes sense. Convoy offers are more relaxed environment where you wont get rammed by random players from the CD road and it has AI traffic and it also offers you to use any mod you want. We cant do that atm. And so it does make sense that we lost some players to that. But to say that RTS drove a lot of players away is simply not really true. Usually the people who where mad with RTS, where the people who had a hard time following the rules. These days we have about the numbers we had before RTS. But we have never had as many people playing as we did during RTS.

 

That's a very impartial way to look at the stats.

 

A year after RTS was introduced, TMP reached its highest player peak indeed. The exact period of that peak (March 2020-May 2020), also happened to have a global quarantine. I wouldn't call that stat impartial or use it to point out that RTS was responsible for that spike, especially since it collapsed once the quarantine rules were lifted. Even looking at Steam stats you can see that on April 2020, the people playing ets2 increased by ~10k.

 

Then comes another impartial period. November 2020 to May 2021 with more travelling restrictions, partial quarantine & more covid rules. Every video game in the world saw a spike in its playerbase at the time but i certainly wouldn't take into consideration these stats thinking that TMP did something to attract all these players. They were circumstancial again. And by the way, the peak in 2021 is almost the same peak as Christmas of 2017.

 

Not taking into account these periods, the RTS which got into effect since May 2019 shows pretty much the same numbers as 2018 which to me that means that the game stalled.

 

And when it matters to player numbers today compared to before RTS, i don't really have to take your word for. Looking at the internet archives, you can see the yearly average number of players

 

2016-2017: 2,456.42 Average yearly players - (2017 snapshot) ( https://web.archive.org/web/20170315084210/https://stats.truckersmp.com/ )

2017-2018: 3,658.18 Average yearly players - (2018 snapshot) ( https://web.archive.org/web/20180830171200/https://stats.truckersmp.com/ )

2018-2019: 3,700.69 Average yearly players - (2019 snapshot) ( https://web.archive.org/web/20190510020355/https://stats.truckersmp.com/ )

 

That's before RTS. The average yearly players today are 2,271.36 so please don't tell me that the mod today has as many people playing as before RTS. 2016 to 2017, TMP saw the biggest growth in numbers ever recorded when even in 2020 the game averaged ~4.1k players, which was a growth of 400 from 2019 and assisted by all covid restrictions.

 

 

 

 

 

[MrSirViking]

4 hours ago, Random_Truck_Driver said:

 

That's a very impartial way to look at the stats.

 

A year after RTS was introduced, TMP reached its highest player peak indeed. The exact period of that peak (March 2020-May 2020), also happened to have a global quarantine. I wouldn't call that stat impartial or use it to point out that RTS was responsible for that spike, especially since it collapsed once the quarantine rules were lifted. Even looking at Steam stats you can see that on April 2020, the people playing ets2 increased by ~10k.

 

Then comes another impartial period. November 2020 to May 2021 with more travelling restrictions, partial quarantine & more covid rules. Every video game in the world saw a spike in its playerbase at the time but i certainly wouldn't take into consideration these stats thinking that TMP did something to attract all these players. They were circumstancial again. And by the way, the peak in 2021 is almost the same peak as Christmas of 2017.

 

Not taking into account these periods, the RTS which got into effect since May 2019 shows pretty much the same numbers as 2018 which to me that means that the game stalled.

 

And when it matters to player numbers today compared to before RTS, i don't really have to take your word for. Looking at the internet archives, you can see the yearly average number of players

 

2016-2017: 2,456.42 Average yearly players - (2017 snapshot) ( https://web.archive.org/web/20170315084210/https://stats.truckersmp.com/ )

2017-2018: 3,658.18 Average yearly players - (2018 snapshot) ( https://web.archive.org/web/20180830171200/https://stats.truckersmp.com/ )

2018-2019: 3,700.69 Average yearly players - (2019 snapshot) ( https://web.archive.org/web/20190510020355/https://stats.truckersmp.com/ )

 

That's before RTS. The average yearly players today are 2,271.36 so please don't tell me that the mod today has as many people playing as before RTS. 2016 to 2017, TMP saw the biggest growth in numbers ever recorded when even in 2020 the game averaged ~4.1k players, which was a growth of 400 from 2019 and assisted by all covid restrictions.

 

 

 

 

 

But even with RTS people still played this game when they all of a sudden had a lot of free time cause of Covid. There are plenty of other games to play but people still chose to play TMP even with RTS. Which shows that RTS did not matter that much to people when they all of a sudden had extra time on their hands. People tend to complain a lot about things when they dont need them. And when they suddenly do there isent a lot of complaining any more. RTS was not a problem as long as you kept to the rules. Which isent that had. There is quite a lot of people who has been here since 2014, that has never been banned. And so if you get banned you broke the rules and should maybe consider how you are driving. And what i meant was that we are back to normal numbers considering that SCS Convoy is a thing as well. So all in all i think things are going well.

[Random_Truck_Driver]

4 hours ago, MrSirViking said:

But even with RTS people still played this game when they all of a sudden had a lot of free time cause of Covid. There are plenty of other games to play but people still chose to play TMP even with RTS. Which shows that RTS did not matter that much to people when they all of a sudden had extra time on their hands. People tend to complain a lot about things when they dont need them. And when they suddenly do there isent a lot of complaining any more. RTS was not a problem as long as you kept to the rules. Which isent that had. There is quite a lot of people who has been here since 2014, that has never been banned. And so if you get banned you broke the rules and should maybe consider how you are driving. And what i meant was that we are back to normal numbers considering that SCS Convoy is a thing as well. So all in all i think things are going well.

 

Even with RTS, TMP still had monopoly over multiplayer before Convoy, so they could pretty much enforce any rule they liked and the people who wanted to play with their friends would still follow it (at least most of them).

 

But did you ever wonder why the mod had better peaks in 2017 than 2019 when ETS2 averaged ~13k players in 2017 and ~18k on 2019? 

 

And please explain to me why have the mod managers retracted several decisions imposed by RTS, If it was so successful?

 

Also i'm not sure what you mean by 'we are back to normal numbers'. Ever since Convoy, TMP averages ~2.2k players per year and that hasn't changed and it doesn't look like changing...

[MrSirViking]

1 hour ago, Random_Truck_Driver said:

 

Even with RTS, TMP still had monopoly over multiplayer before Convoy, so they could pretty much enforce any rule they liked and the people who wanted to play with their friends would still follow it (at least most of them).

 

But did you ever wonder why the mod had better peaks in 2017 than 2019 when ETS2 averaged ~13k players in 2017 and ~18k on 2019? 

 

And please explain to me why have the mod managers retracted several decisions imposed by RTS, If it was so successful?

 

Also i'm not sure what you mean by 'we are back to normal numbers'. Ever since Convoy, TMP averages ~2.2k players per year and that hasn't changed and it doesn't look like changing...

Sure we had monopoly but that does not mean people have to play online. If they hate RTS so much then just dont play. As i said there are plenty of other games, like right now steam has more than 50000 games. So no one is forcing anyone to play TMP. If they choose to play here anyway then maybe RTS is not as bad as some people make it. At least not bad enough that people dont want to play.

No i dont wonder about that stuff. We are a multiplayer mod. We are not a company that needs to make money. If we dont get enough donations to keep servers running then we just close. We dont get paid to do this. So its not something that has to keep going. And so if we loose a few people over something, its not the end of the world, so i dont wonder too much about the numbers.

Well because management change. Different people want different things. And also because we do listen to the community. And so after some community polls we changed some things. Things might have been a little too harsh and so things where changed. That doesent mean that RTS was not successful, just that we also do listen. 

[Random_Truck_Driver]

1 hour ago, MrSirViking said:

Sure we had monopoly but that does not mean people have to play online. If they hate RTS so much then just dont play. As i said there are plenty of other games, like right now steam has more than 50000 games. So no one is forcing anyone to play TMP. If they choose to play here anyway then maybe RTS is not as bad as some people make it. At least not bad enough that people dont want to play.

 

I never said that people hated RTS, but rather that it made the game less fun and drove a lot of players away myself included.

 

Quote

No i dont wonder about that stuff. We are a multiplayer mod. We are not a company that needs to make money. If we dont get enough donations to keep servers running then we just close. We dont get paid to do this. So its not something that has to keep going. And so if we loose a few people over something, its not the end of the world, so i dont wonder too much about the numbers.

 

Well you brought up the numbers. If you don't wonder about the numbers, perhaps you shouldn't mention them. Plus there are people being paid behind this mod (or so they've said). I'm assuming they care and they want to keep going.

 

Quote

Well because management change. Different people want different things. And also because we do listen to the community. And so after some community polls we changed some things. Things might have been a little too harsh and so things where changed. That doesent mean that RTS was not successful, just that we also do listen. 

 

Actually the past year is the only time i've seen the management of the mod listening to the community on important subjects. Nobody was asked for RTS and no polls were made. Like i said, it's easy to enforce decisions when you have monopoly. It's not so easy when players can choose. Convoy put some pressure on TMP to do better or fade away. And the decisions to revert several aspects of RTS certainly don't make it look good.

[Nody]

Heya!

 

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We apply these procedures in order to keep the forum organized and structured. 

 

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